Signed programmes

[Tcm2007]

A thought occurs; the RT data includes whether or not a programme is signed for the death.

It would therefore be possible in principle to make it so TiVo did not record those 2am showings under a season pass for the un-signed show.

For me, that would be a boon; but would others find it a problem?

[healeydave]

I don't see why if any new feature can be made, as long as we can make it an option it's a bonus!

[spitfires]

Yes it would be a help.

What would be ideal although probably not possible, would be to ignore the signed programme unless there is no other showing scheduled.

E.g. upcoming scheule:
Planet Earth 02:00 signed
Planet Earth 21:00
= record the later unsigned version

E.g. upcoming scheule:
Planet Earth 02:00 signed
no unsigned showing scheduled
= record the signed version since any version is better than none!

I doubt that's possible though?

[Tcm2007]

Two possible ways of tacking it I've thought of so far.

One is to move signed showings into a new series eg "Top Gear (Signed)", so it wouldn't record unless you told it to.

The other is to force an old OAD on signed shows, so a First Run Only SP would not pick them up.

The latter while in some ways neater, has more potential for error.

[davidshack]

Good idea, TCM2007.
Yes, please,it would be a help - and an improvement.


In terms of usage, surely most people will either:

a) always choose a signed version if available (if they are hard of hearing)

or b) always choose a not-signed version (if they are not hard of hearing)

The occasional exception being if someone has (for example) missed the original transmissions & so will be glad to get any recording, signed or not, as Spitfires said.


Plse excuse a quick & dirty idea, but . . .
Might it be possible/easier to code/create a general preference field for signing?
eg under MESSAGES & SETUP > PREFERENCES >
Users could set SIGNING as they now set their other preferences eg "video recording quality"
Always assuming this setting could then be used to automatically flag/filter the RT data and so choose to record the preferred version (not-signed/signed).


Plse may I suggest:
Setting an IF THEN (ie IF no unsigned version THEN record signed) could risk duplicate recordings of signed versions WHERE signed & unsigned are not broadcast close together - eg not within the (2? wk) period of the guide data being searched. But how much does that happen? And better to have 2 recordings than none?

Setting an old OAD might not help everyone: eg lots of my wishlists/SPs are for "all showings" giving me the chance to catch episodes I missed when first shown (eg in previous yr). Natural World type programmes as well as series that I only discovered late!


Seems to me the root of the problem at the moment is that the programme information screen (under both Progs to Record & To Do list) does NOT indicate if the transmission is a signed version. If it did, wouldn't take a user that long each week to manually scan their To Do list prog details, spot any "signed" transmissions, look for an alternative and set that instead.

So, worst case, if RT "signing" status could be put onto the programme information screen (eg as R for "repeat" does), users could find their preferred version themselves.

HTH

[poppadum]

Just thinking out loud here: it would theoretically be feasible to add another program flag to the 'bits' field for a showing (currently used for things like subtitles,black and white, live, premiere, widescreen, HD etc) to indicate a signed programme. It would need some work on the Tivo end to detect it and act accordingly, but it might be neater than using a separate series ID?

Edit: Sorry, David - I reread your post and you've just suggested this.

[Tcm2007]

Any suggestion that involves altering the TiVo software (like acting on flags or adding a menu option) you can assume is impossible.

Like most hacks, you need to creatively think how to alter the database to get the function you need.

[poppadum]

Any suggestion that involves altering the TiVo software (like acting on flags or adding a menu option) you can assume is impossible.

Yeah, I was imagining a hack along the lines of endpad which wakes up every so often, scans the recordings list and removes any with the signed flag set. The bits field is a bitmask so if there are any unused bits (and I haven't delved deeply enough to see if there are) might we be able to use one to indicate a signed prog? Do you think that's at all feasible or am I barking up the wrong tree?

[davidshack]

Any suggestion that involves altering the TiVo software (like acting on flags or adding a menu option) you can assume is impossible.

Thanks for explaining, I'll bear that in mind in my future "bright ideas".
cheers

[irrelevant]

It's not completely impossible - the Daily Call allows for the sending of scripts down to the tivo for subsequent execution, which would in theory allow for any modifications to the client code required. I'm having a poke about in this mechanism at the moment, but don't count any chickens yet - it relies on signed code which is going to be tricky to deal with.

[krayzeekev]

Just thinking out loud here: it would theoretically be feasible to add another program flag to the 'bits' field for a showing (currently used for things like subtitles,black and white, live, premiere, widescreen, HD etc) to indicate a signed programme. It would need some work on the Tivo end to detect it and act accordingly, but it might be neater than using a separate series ID?

Edit: Sorry, David - I reread your post and you've just suggested this.

The bit is already there. In the oztivo software the SDE entry for bits is "CC" and the field is called "captions" in the software. I'm not sure if it's an Australian thing or a standard term but the terminology used for "signed" showings is "Close Captioned".

[irrelevant]

The bit is already there. In the oztivo software the SDE entry for bits is "CC" and the field is called "captions" in the software. I'm not sure if it's an Australian thing or a standard term but the terminology used for "signed" showings is "Close Captioned".

Is that not what we think of as teletext subtitles ? Which the UK TiVo handles possibly uniquely among the various offerings..

[krayzeekev]

The bit is already there. In the oztivo software the SDE entry for bits is "CC" and the field is called "captions" in the software. I'm not sure if it's an Australian thing or a standard term but the terminology used for "signed" showings is "Close Captioned".

Is that not what we think of as teletext subtitles ? Which the UK TiVo handles possibly uniquely among the various offerings..

Well, in the old analogue days, yes. In digital it's not teletext any more. The subtitles are part of the stream in a more integrated way. Closed Captioning is a use of subtitles. In Oz, the two are almost synonymous as I can't think of another use of subtitles other than Closed Captions.

OH WAIT! I've just realised I've made a presumption here that may be wrong. When you say it's signed for the deaf, you're literally talking about somebody in the corner of the screen signing. Which IS very different to CC.

And so, yes, you'd need a new bit for that. Not sure how you'd push it through all the way to the TiVo interface. Looks like an endpad style solution would be the way to go. But the code in endpad is not simple. tcl never appears to be

[spitfires]

When you say it's signed for the deaf, you're literally talking about somebody in the corner of the screen signing. Which IS very different to CC.

Yes - "Flappy Hands Lady" (tm)

[Tcm2007]

Which is why I think processing that data in the description so that it put the episode in a separate Series would be the way to go - no TiVo end mods required, and the default would be no flappy hands. If you wanted/didn't care you could add a separate SP for the signed version.

EndPad must be simple, I wrote it and I can't code!