How can I help?

[pemills]

I think what Dave Healey has said is by far the best approach, big corporations like TiVo inc and VM would not think twice about trying to squish a small band of rebel S1 users, let's see the new EPG up and running first and then see if we can re-invigorate the other S1 out there that maybe had been unaware of the alternative EPG and the possibility to resurrect their supposedly 'dead' but beloved TiVo

[Pete77]

The exclusivity deal is between Virgin and Tivo for a new service and it has nothing to do with the old defunct service that was between tivo and bskyb. We were here first and VM would have some audacity to try and preach to us what we can and can't do with our bought & paid for hardware!

Dave,

I take your point however Virgin do seem to have shown a great deal more audacity and lack of sensitivity regarding the existing S1 Tivo service than one might have expected. And if the exclusivity deal between VM & Tivo has nothing to do with our old S1 service then why is it being discontinued by almost exactly the same date as a new Tivo will be available to anyone in a Virgin cabled area who wants one?

Clearly Virgin not serving 50% of the country with its new Tivo service is a very contentious matter indeed and the obvious way to defuse this was to make it clear existing S1 boxes would be supported indefinitely and equally that for those living in a Virgin cabled area that upgrading was a choice that would give you a more modern Tivo but that equally if you were happy with your current Tivo nothing would change. Result everyone wins and nobody starts saying bad things about Tivo or Virgin's treatment of old S1 customers.

But here a rapacious Virgin has been rudely and regularly sending out messages to upgrade or else and Tivo's so called Vice President of International Sales etc has taken away his ball and refused to play when challenged on the matter. So in those circumstances I really don't think that Tivo can be trusted given that we seem to represent an inconvenient past that contradicts the Virgin marketing message that this is a wholly new product in the UK.

[spitfires]

If we don't try and contact everyone until after 31st May then it will be too late - their TiVos will have stopped working and in the absence of any known alternative they will skip them (assuming they haven't already done by that time).

People need to know NOW that a replacement service will be available.

Re Virgin getting upset at "stealing" their potential customer base, there are two considerations here:
(i) it is just that... "potential", we would not be stealing their "customers" so they have no cause to cry foul on this matter,
(ii) we simply market our replacement as being for S1 users who cannot get Virgin and make no mention of Virgin areas. (A classic marcomms ploy and one pushed by errr Virgin and TiVo Inc. just recently in fact!).

There is no way TiVo Inc would do anything to kill our boxes (out of spite) and no way that Virgin would let them do so. That would be marcomms suicide!!

.

[Pete77]

There is no way TiVo Inc would do anything to kill our boxes (out of spite) and no way that Virgin would let them do so. That would be marcomms suicide!!

I wish had your confidence in that regard. The person responsible for marketing the Tivo at Virgin has so far shown absolutely no sign of respect towards the original UK Tivo user group.

[spitfires]

Indeed, but simply ignoring (someone else's) customers is a world away from deliberately killing customer's bought & paid for equipment - the implications for their future action on their existing customers would make this suicidal.

[Pete77]

Indeed, but simply ignoring (someone else's) customers is a world away from deliberately killing customer's bought & paid for equipment - the implications for their future action on their existing customers would make this suicidal.

Except that Virgin Media don't sell any equipment to their customers but only rent it to them. Their customers therefore have no concern about the long term future of their purchase but only about its ongoing monthly cost.

I don't therefore see why the move is suicidal in the way that you claim?

[gcobb]

I think the key thing is to do the publicity in such a way that if Tivo were to take action against the project, the same publications would pick that up and make a fuss about it. The two important messages for that are: 1) the capability to set up a non-Tivo service and not pay subscription fees has been available for many years but the community has deliberately and voluntarily never done that (in fact, the relevant code is still kept secret and only released to people who agree not to replace the Tivo service where it is offered); 2) the Tivo boxes were purchased and are owned by the people who bought them -- they have been willing to pay for service (either regularly or as a lump sum) as long as Tivo were willing to offer it -- any action taken to deliberately damage these boxes or prevent their continued use would be likely to result in legal issues (under things like the Computer Misuse Act).

How about a separate thread to discuss the messaging and other aspects of a publicity campaign (including timing)? My day job is marketing and I would be happy to contribute.

[Pete77]

they have been willing to pay for service (either regularly or as a lump sum) as long as Tivo were willing to offer it

However Tivo and Virgin can of course argue that they are willing to continue offering service to those living in a Virgin Media cable area on their new Tivo box.

The weakness in their position is that they aren't willing to provide the replacement box free of charge to existing Tivo customers or even to continue to honour the Lifetime Service already paid for by the S1 Tivo box owners living in a Virgin Media cabled area.

[Orddu]

Location Worcester? Really

Yep, on the corner of Warndon Villages right by the hospital in fact

Plus we have 3 TiVos, 2 in active service and a "backup spare" with cachecard etc., so if that became handy for us testing a build or something in the future, gimme a yell.

We also have a Windows Media Centre now, which is about to become the most expensive DVD player in the history of everything I think. I hope ;-D

Hehe, yeah, I'm not a windows fan anymore, I used to love MS, now loath them and hate their products, strange how things pan out

[davidshack]

Hehe, if you can figure out how to get the word out to the users that probably never visited a forum in their lives and are considering ditching their tivo reluctantly because all they have is the annoying "Tivo Inc. Death Message" to go on, we would really appreciate it, but I guess with no budget or mailing list, thats stretching anyone's abilities

How about:

- consumer websites such as http://www.moneysavingexpert.com/
Moneysavingexpert is, I believe, VERY approachable. The site had 9.5 MILLION (unique) visitors in March & sends a weekly email newsletter to 6 MILLION. Surely enough friends and family to spread the word to TiVo S1 owners?

or http://www.which.co.uk onsite and/or a Which? magazine news item



I agree with Orddu about:

- Click (actually, I suggest a few seconds of voice-over during "Tech news" would be all that is needed. And the best we'd be likely to get! Failing that, twist their arm to read it out in the "letters" section).
Sell it to Click as a novelty item on the lines of "Users refuse to let TiVos die - hackers create born again service"

- Gadget Show ditto


hope that helps
david

[baward]

- Click (actually, I suggest a few seconds of voice-over during "Tech news" would be all that is needed. And the best we'd be likely to get! Failing that, twist their arm to read it out in the "letters" section).
Sell it to Click as a novelty item on the lines of "Users refuse to let TiVos die - hackers create born again service"

- Gadget Show ditto

hope that helps
david

And the BBC? I used to work there, but unfortunately have lost contact with anyone who might be helpful there...

Ben

[Brother52]

So long as our S1 Tivos are still dialling in the Tivo servers there is the potential for Tivo to send out something nasty software update wise to try to shut down our Tivos for good.

Technically true, but any such action by TiVo Inc. would almost certainly fall foul of the Computer Misuse Act (1990) - and they really wouldn't want to go there...

[chhym]

very late in on this thread.

Freelance Linux sysadm engineer(RedHat certified) and technical document writer.

One upgraded TiVo S1 with an option to get a second S1 who is hoping this project works out...


Chris

[topbanana]

Domestic PC repairman covering much of Scotland, although primarily Aberdeen/shire. Can do on-site hard drive swaps, cachecard installs etc.

[Furbag]

How about a separate thread to discuss the messaging and other aspects of a publicity campaign (including timing)? My day job is marketing and I would be happy to contribute.

Good idea, we need to get word out that TiVo S1 isnt dead, while a TV ad campaign might be a bit beyond our pockets, theres always youtube

Also just googled "TiVo" and in the top 3 returns is the wikki site which while it says the service is going to stop it doesnt mention anything about the AltEPG service should we not be already adding something to the wikki site NOW to help folks realise its not dead in the water


Fur